Eventually it will die out

Escrito por minusSeven, 12.09.2014 at 12:10

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 11:53

Is not about opinion, you can think RP is a good map, but is not.
Its a uncontested consensus in the map making community, that RP performs poorly in all aspects of map making.

Other map makers, including me: don't even recognize RP as a custom map, but just as default map with custom units. Why? Because there is no new borders, all of them are just copy paste of default map.

Meh what has a map got to do with it. People enjoy playing it because its fun for them. I don't give a shit what map making community thinks . People still enjoy playing on the default map as well. Just like RP there is nothing wrong in playing what you want to play. Just enjoy the game.

Here lays the problem, you are defending RP and claiming is a good map that people enjoy.
I told you that regardless if some people enjoy it or not. the map is shit.

Ive never said that people are wrong for playing RP, so plz quit the bullshit.

Escrito por minusSeven, 12.09.2014 at 12:16

please log in the game and play your game with laochra for ladder.he wants to challenge you since yesterday.thanks.

RP is a terrible map in terms of a map itself. Even if people like it, it doesn't mean it's a good map. It's an EASY map and that's why people enjoy playing it.

Escrito por minusSeven, 12.09.2014 at 12:16

Escrito por Guest, 12.09.2014 at 12:04

So it's not fact straight lines are lazy? countries with units that have 15/9 (genuine stats for a German unit) is not unbalanced? Countries given huge economic and reinf boosts? That is simply opinion/ Lolurdum

Lol if this game started with RP as default you would have said the normal world map are crap ! You may think you wouldn't think so but believe me you would because you got accustomed to it.

Meh I just don't understand what all this hatred is about, if you don't like a map just don't play it. Let gamers enjoy what they love instead of trying to dictate what you think is right.

Besides there is nothing stopping you from making any map you like with any kind of unit you want and any extra rules you like. No matter how crappy you make a map I would would never care about it.

I never understand why you have to make ignorant comments in a topic that is not even related to the issue that you are trying to convey.

Nobody in this topic had claimed that playing RP is bad or should be banned. We are just stating the fact that the map is bad, ive provided you with reasons backing my claim.

You in the other hand... Keep repeating a irrelevant statement that we shoudn't care what people play. Now tell me, from were did you come up with that nonsense assumption? Nobody in this topic cares if you play RP, just don't come here and try to claim RP is a good map, because is not.

You take a piece of shit and put icing on it, you can call it a cake.
You take a piece of shit and put vanilla and milk on it and freeze it, you can call it ice-cream.
You take a piece of shit and let it dry out in the sun for a day, you can call it a rock.

No matter what mask you put on it, a piece of shit is a piece of shit.
50k World Games was the first mask.
UN was the second mask.
RP is the third and lastest mask.

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 13:38

You in the other hand... Keep repeating a irrelevant statement that we shoudn't care what people play. Now tell me, from were did you come up with that nonsense assumption? Nobody in this topic cares if you play RP, just don't come here and try to claim RP is a good map, because is not.

LOL how am I the one making ignorant comments. All I am saying is that Your thinking RP is shit and crap is nothing but your opinion nothing else. I never said RP is good.Go look at my game history and find a RP. I think its crap because there are far too much money and units going around in that. But this too is my opinion nothing else. I am not remotely interested in defending RP. All I am saying is your opinion of RP is just an opinion and if don't like it don't play it. Let people who like it on their own.

This whole topic is just based on an opinion and we could talk endlessly about this come to no conclusion. Thats why I said to close/lock this topic.

Escrito por minusSeven, 12.09.2014 at 14:13

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 13:38

You in the other hand... Keep repeating a irrelevant statement that we shoudn't care what people play. Now tell me, from were did you come up with that nonsense assumption? Nobody in this topic cares if you play RP, just don't come here and try to claim RP is a good map, because is not.

LOL how am I the one making ignorant comments. All I am saying is that Your thinking RP is shit and crap is nothing but your opinion nothing else. I never said RP is good.Go look at my game history and find a RP. I think its crap because there are far too much money and units going around in that. But this too is my opinion nothing else. I am not remotely interested in defending RP. All I am saying is your opinion of RP is just an opinion and if don't like it don't play it. Let people who like it on their own.

This whole topic is just based on an opinion and we could talk endlessly about this come to no conclusion. Thats why I said to close/lock this topic.

Is it me, or are you repeating the same thing?

Escrito por minusSeven, 12.09.2014 at 12:16

Escrito por Guest, 12.09.2014 at 12:04

So it's not fact straight lines are lazy? countries with units that have 15/9 (genuine stats for a German unit) is not unbalanced? Countries given huge economic and reinf boosts? That is simply opinion/ Lolurdum

Lol if this game started with RP as default you would have said the normal world map are crap ! You may think you wouldn't think so but believe me you would because you got accustomed to it.

Meh I just don't understand what all this hatred is about, if you don't like a map just don't play it. Let gamers enjoy what they love instead of trying to dictate what you think is right.

Besides there is nothing stopping you from making any map you like with any kind of unit you want and any extra rules you like. No matter how crappy you make a map I would would never care about it.

I don't think I would, I would listen to the high ranks saying'' default map is for noobs who have no skill'' and play different games (but probably play some default).
RP can still exist, but it's a SP farm and should be nerfed.

This whole "roleplay is bad" argument is really only based on the (completely true) fact that not many other games fill up besides Roleplay or games similar to it. When it comes to SP, it really shouldn't matter. Only fools believe that rank shows your prestige of skill in AtWar, and regardless of the upgrades you have, if you can't actually use the upgrades effectively, there isn't much you can do better than say, a rank 6 who has some skill on how to play strategically. Of course, there is still always the option to remove SP entirely from Role Play to make it the generic, laid back, lazy game it was born to be.

It's starting to span out from "they gain too much SP and therefore get better upgrades" to "they get too much SP and now can show off their ranks to players". All that really shows is that those who use that argument just want their prestige of working on their own rank to show-off to other smaller ranks, who can look up to them. In a sense, it's to have more popularity among the newbies, which doesn't fulfill the desire to have games such as 3v3, WWII, world games, etc. get filled that they also too like they complain about.

If you truly want this Role Play thing to die out, give the new players a chance and either make specific games designed to showcase the elements of economics or the elements of battling and militarism. I'm sure many of the new people yearn to gain these skills from a Role Play game, but can't do so because it has such unimaginably easy tasks to complete in both economics and battling. They don't have much of another option considering the hate they get from higher ranks who call out on every mistake they make and call them RPfags. If you honestly believe encouraging them to go back to RP, or calling them out on their mistakes instead of their progresses will help deaden Role Play, you're exactly the jackass that will keep it popularized.

Concluding this, it's very sad that the "professional mapmakers" haven't decided to instead of train newbies with putting them in the field of battle with people or higher skill, give them maps that focus on one main point(make the incomes very easy to manage, but with few units and harder to kill so they have to learn their mistakes, or make the armies easy to use, plentiful in supply, but god awful economies).

Escrito por Aleph One, 12.09.2014 at 21:26

This whole "roleplay is bad" argument is really only based on the (completely true) fact that not many other games fill up besides Roleplay or games similar to it. When it comes to SP, it really shouldn't matter. Only fools believe that rank shows your prestige of skill in AtWar, and regardless of the upgrades you have, if you can't actually use the upgrades effectively, there isn't much you can do better than say, a rank 6 who has some skill on how to play strategically. Of course, there is still always the option to remove SP entirely from Role Play to make it the generic, laid back, lazy game it was born to be.

Agree, but rank inflation is not good either.

Escrito por Aleph One, 12.09.2014 at 21:26

It's starting to span out from "they gain too much SP and therefore get better upgrades" to "they get too much SP and now can show off their ranks to players". All that really shows is that those who use that argument just want their prestige of working on their own rank to show-off to other smaller ranks, who can look up to them. In a sense, it's to have more popularity among the newbies, which doesn't fulfill the desire to have games such as 3v3, WWII, world games, etc. get filled that they also too like they complain about.

Actually, ranks use to matter, since before custom maps rank use to be the equivalent of experience and therefore skill.

Escrito por Aleph One, 12.09.2014 at 21:26

If you truly want this Role Play thing to die out, give the new players a chance and either make specific games designed to showcase the elements of economics or the elements of battling and militarism. I'm sure many of the new people yearn to gain these skills from a Role Play game, but can't do so because it has such unimaginably easy tasks to complete in both economics and battling. They don't have much of another option considering the hate they get from higher ranks who call out on every mistake they make and call them RPfags. If you honestly believe encouraging them to go back to RP, or calling them out on their mistakes instead of their progresses will help deaden Role Play, you're exactly the jackass that will keep it popularized.

You mean Europe 10k?

Escrito por Aleph One, 12.09.2014 at 21:26

Concluding this, it's very sad that the "professional mapmakers" haven't decided to instead of train newbies with putting them in the field of battle with people or higher skill, give them maps that focus on one main point(make the incomes very easy to manage, but with few units and harder to kill so they have to learn their mistakes, or make the armies easy to use, plentiful in supply, but god awful economies).

So now is our fault for not making maps with dumbed down mechanics? They can play Europe 10k or join a training clan like the rest of atwar.

Holding the hand of a low rank is annoying, unless he is in the same clan. Why should i explain a rank 7 how to wall, when i discover it by myself at rank 1. Besides... i play atwar to win, not to explain my enemy how to be like me, yet i would love to see him invent moves to counter me and read my movements.

Cita:

Escrito por Aleph One, 12.09.2014 at 21:26

Concluding this, it's very sad that the "professional mapmakers" haven't decided to instead of train newbies with putting them in the field of battle with people or higher skill, give them maps that focus on one main point(make the incomes very easy to manage, but with few units and harder to kill so they have to learn their mistakes, or make the armies easy to use, plentiful in supply, but god awful economies).

So now is our fault for not making maps with dumbed down mechanics? They can play Europe 10k or join a training clan like the rest of atwar.

Holding the hand of a low rank is annoying, unless he is in the same clan. Why should i explain a rank 7 how to wall, when i discover it by myself at rank 1. Besides... i play atwar to win, not to explain my enemy how to be like me, yet i would love to see him invent moves to counter me and read my movements.

You're taking it out of context. The point was that mapmakers shouldn't feel threatened or angry that a map like RP has surfaced, and if they do, don't complain about it without trying to appeal to what obviously RP players demand, but within a more defined border.

By the way, if you would rather not teach a rank 7 and play atwar to win, I don't see why RP would be so bad then, since you'd get much weaker, non-experienced players challenging you thinking their high rank will safe-guard them. It's a better position of power for you, so why bother criticize it?

Lastly, sure, they can play 10k games like the rest of us, but times change and leaning styles differ. Some can't learn in that fashion, and need a more controlled, easier approach to it. So it's not so much holding their hand, but giving them the opportunity to learn in a new way. You aren't coaching them by making the map, you're giving them the tool to learn how the mechanics of competitive play works rather than how over-powered economies and units work in RP.

Escrito por clovis1122, 10.09.2014 at 19:20

Why so much hating against RP? it is fun come on

inb4 people that dont even try to play the map are critizing it. PLAY THE MAP FIRST. Even if you played it, the great amount of people that play RP already prove it to be a good map.

its great if the people would die, the community of players makes RP unbearable

Escrito por minusSeven, 11.09.2014 at 16:21

Escrito por Tundy, 11.09.2014 at 13:39

It was a decent topic, until clovis went full delusional...

What delusional whether RP is good or bad is just an individual opinion. nothing else. This topic needs to be deleted and provides nothing new or helpful to the community as such.

except that deleting it does nothing, this is a style of thread posted over and over again, deleting it does nothing, and it isnt against any rules, we are discussing our views on RP and how it effects our side of the community.

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 22:16

Actually, ranks use to matter, since before custom maps rank use to be the equivalent of experience and therefore skill.

Lies. Back in my time, rank 7 was able to beat rank 10 ( there was no UN or any custom map, just competitive envioment). Subestimate your opponent because rank was the worst thing you could do.

Escrito por clovis1122, 13.09.2014 at 22:10

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 22:16

Actually, ranks use to matter, since before custom maps rank use to be the equivalent of experience and therefore skill.

Lies. Back in my time, rank 7 was able to beat rank 10 ( there was no UN or any custom map, just competitive envioment).

and the normal was 10's beat 7's, you act like luck or a bad high rank isnt possible, we see it all the time with crits, a player can get lucky, or just be better, but he is saying the majority of 10v7 back in the day would end in 10 winning, and actually he was probably referring to 8v5 or some shit as other than opi there arent many strictly RP rank 10s

Escrito por clovis1122, 13.09.2014 at 22:16

Escrito por Quantum027, 13.09.2014 at 22:13

Escrito por clovis1122, 13.09.2014 at 22:10

Escrito por Tundy, 12.09.2014 at 22:16

Actually, ranks use to matter, since before custom maps rank use to be the equivalent of experience and therefore skill.

Lies. Back in my time, rank 7 was able to beat rank 10 ( there was no UN or any custom map, just competitive envioment).

and the normal was 10's beat 7's, you act like luck or a bad high rank isnt possible, we see it all the time with crits, a player can get lucky, or just be better, but he is saying the majority of 10v7 back in the day would end in 10 winning, and actually he was probably referring to 8v5 or some shit as other than opi there arent many strictly RP rank 10s

Some fact's which can help you to understand why rank didn't matte much in Afterwind:

► General was free.

► Clan War where very stricty, but way better that they are now. There also was a very high amount of <<training clans>>

► The TB system charge also influenced on it.

► Also, 5k was the standart.

► Rank limit for 3vs3 was 6 (standart).

I dont see the point you are trying to make. some 101 on discussing, you have to actually refute your opponents points, cause you just shitted out facts that mean nothing because we are talking about the skill difference in high ranks to mid ranks before the rise of RP

Escrito por clovis1122, 13.09.2014 at 22:30

Escrito por Quantum027, 13.09.2014 at 22:18

I dont see the point you are trying to make. some 101 on discussing, you have to actually refute your opponents points, cause you just shitted out facts that mean nothing because we are talking about the skill difference in high ranks to mid ranks before the rise of RP

oh before the rise of RP? you mean before UN die right? This is before the merge:

► General was free.

► 3vs3 standart settings where rank 7

► Rank 8 and 9 where the best ranks, since they had the most sucefull games.

► Also there where many training clans around.

BTW, stop hating against UN. Check this guy, his name is zombiekiller . A total UN player, he beat TopHats in duel on his first try. 4 days after that, topHats dueled him again and won. I think TopHats say that they two are 2 - 3 counting 1vs1 and duels.

Even though the impact of custom maps on atWar competence is debatable, it mainly die because the charges on the CW system. Read here:

when was i bashing UN, that is all i played as a low rank and i love/loved it, sooooo, ive played way more in the custom maps than you and most of the EU+ competitive players in the amount of time ive played, and rank 8s and 9s being the best ranks before this merge, how the hell does this even matter, i was talking about low ranks beating high ranks, the actual number isnt the point, its that in reality, high ranks beat low ranks in nearly every time they play, now with RP there are more rank 8s and 9s and they tend to lose more, but the past still stands about rank 7s beating rank 10s is a rare event

Escrito por Guest, 14.09.2014 at 06:49

Escrito por minusSeven, 14.09.2014 at 05:26

Escrito por Guest, 14.09.2014 at 04:55

are fact based.

Na At most they may be opinion based on facts but they are still opinions

They are facts

Escrito por Guest, 13.09.2014 at 23:59

According to what I heard, TopHats isn't exactly pro any more.

That's true. TopHats already say he retired from atWar competence. However, I was refering to the times before the merge where TopHats was strong as fuck.

Escrito por Quantum027, 13.09.2014 at 22:48

but the past still stands about rank 7s beating rank 10s is a rare event

It was not a rare event. It was very common. Already posted you some points about why rank 7 had a competitive envioment and was capable of beat rank 10. If you get the right upgrades according to your favorite strat, then there was not upgrade difference at all. The training clans exist for it. The best players where between rank 8 and 9, theses where the ones which compose most of the 3vs3.

You cant really compare the Afterwind society with the currently atWar society. Nowadays there ain't very much training clans. They soon started to die. And while they die, atWar competence also die. In consecuence, theses players which should be playing 3vs3 and whole world started to play UN and RP ( since training clan dies, there was nobody to tell them what is competitive and what is not). Some of the competitive players also left the game in that period.

Cita:

Escrito por clovis1122, 14.09.2014 at 10:56

Escrito por Guest, 13.09.2014 at 23:59

...

...

..Nowadays there ain't very much training clans. They soon started to die. And while they die, atWar competence also die. In consecuence, theses players which should be playing 3vs3 and whole world started to play UN and RP ( since training clan dies, there was nobody to tell them what is competitive and what is not). Some of the competitive players also left the game in that period.

I call it the great dying. Honestly there is no getting out of it the way the game is heading. One person can't make a difference the game itself needs a reform, and we all know thats not happening till HTML5

Eventually, everything will die out, except this thread. Meester, pls lock this.

Escrito por minusSeven, 14.09.2014 at 02:04

Escrito por Quantum027, 13.09.2014 at 22:08

except that deleting it does nothing, this is a style of thread posted over and over again, deleting it does nothing, and it isnt against any rules, we are discussing our views on RP and how it effects our side of the community.

If the content doesn't directly help the community it should be taken to off topic section especially these discussion are opinion based.

depends on your opinion of helping the community, cause everything helps and doesnt in a certain way, and off topic used to always be for things that had nothing to do with atwar itself, this actually has more to do with atwar than 60% of the active topics in General Discussion.

Before the merge? You mean during Afterwind, amirite? Was Opi even playing then?

Escrito por Guest, 14.09.2014 at 13:31

Before the merge? You mean during Afterwind, amirite? Was Opi even playing then?

No he wasn't.

Check this guy, BautistaR3. He is very strong rank 6 without general, but he got trained from the start, and he is getting competitive upgrades.



All he need is Expendanable infantry and Air transport capacity II, and guess what, he is already looking for get it! [ 22k SP, going for expendanable first] . He also read a lot of forum post and get knowledge from many people specially hdrakon. With 20K SP till rank 7, he can get both upgrades and play at his max potencial. He have the most valuable upgrades already, exept for general ones. If we where in old atWar where general was free, you shouldn't dunno that he would get those too.

Now think about this: What if all the low ranks get trained like this? Strong right? well this was very usual in Afterwind society!!!! ( I got trained like this too! ). And I think many high ranks of today also got trained like this.

Escrito por clovis1122, 14.09.2014 at 20:11

Check this guy, BautistaR3. He is very strong rank 6 without general, but he got trained from the start, and he is getting competitive upgrades.



All he need is Expendanable infantry and Air transport capacity II, and guess what, he is already looking for get it! [ 22k SP, going for expendanable first] . He also read a lot of forum post and get knowledge from many people specially hdrakon. With 20K SP till rank 7, he can get both upgrades and play at his max potencial. He have the most valuable upgrades already, exept for general ones. If we where in old atWar where general was free, you shouldn't dunno that he would get those too.

Now think about this: What if all the low ranks get trained like this? Strong right? well this was very usual in Afterwind society!!!! ( I got trained like this too! ). And I think many high ranks of today also got trained like this.

You know that high ranks teaching low ranks, proves that high ranks are more skilled/experienced?
Therefore low ranks are only "good" if they are trained, anybody can become a pro if he is trained,
Look at ex RP fags, do you seriously think they would be any good if wasn't for a fellow high rank training them?

PD: I wasn't ever trained, so I didn't become good until rank 8.

Escrito por Tundy, 14.09.2014 at 20:25

You know that high ranks teaching low ranks, proves that high ranks are more skilled/experienced?
Therefore low ranks are only "good" if they are trained, anybody can become a pro if he is trained,
Look at ex RP fags, do you seriously think they would be any good if wasn't for a fellow high rank training them?

PD: I wasn't ever trained, so I didn't become good until rank 8.

Yeah, you are again sayding somenthing like: " If tophats beat chess in europe duel, then mauzer is the best player on asia". There is not relation between what you are trying to comment.

My example was for give facts enough for approve THIS premise
:

Escrito por clovis1122, 14.09.2014 at 10:56

Escrito por Quantum027, 13.09.2014 at 22:48

but the past still stands about rank 7s beating rank 10s is a rare event

It was not a rare event. It was very common. Already posted you some points about why rank 7 had a competitive envioment and was capable of beat rank 10. If you get the right upgrades according to your favorite strat, then there was not upgrade difference at all. The training clans exist for it. The best players where between rank 8 and 9, theses where the ones which compose most of the 3vs3.

You cant really compare the Afterwind society with the currently atWar society. Nowadays there ain't very much training clans. They soon started to die. And while they die, atWar competence also die. In consecuence, theses players which should be playing 3vs3 and whole world started to play UN and RP ( since training clan dies, there was nobody to tell them what is competitive and what is not). Some of the competitive players also left the game in that period.

However, you wanna to somehow relate this to RP. What you think? Do you think that people which play RP and doesnt get any type of training are worsen that people which play 3vs3's and scenarios and dont get ANY TYPE OF TRAIN ?

Escrito por clovis1122, 14.09.2014 at 20:32

Escrito por Tundy, 14.09.2014 at 20:25

You know that high ranks teaching low ranks, proves that high ranks are more skilled/experienced?
Therefore low ranks are only "good" if they are trained, anybody can become a pro if he is trained,
Look at ex RP fags, do you seriously think they would be any good if wasn't for a fellow high rank training them?

PD: I wasn't ever trained, so I didn't become good until rank 8.

Yeah, you are again sayding somenthing like: " If tophats beat chess in europe duel, then mauzer is the best player on asia". There is not relation between what you are trying to comment.

Let me break down and simplify my argument, for a naive individual like you to understand:

Low ranks are only good if they are trained by high ranks, therefore a non-trained low rank can't beat a high rank.
The picture that you provided above actually reinforces my argument. Therefore it's clear that you are only making vague statements to look as if you knew something, when you really don't.

Scenarios imo do help out in some cases. just as an example, ultimate WWII is a scenario that has balance in it. it has two teams and makes it more 1 v 1 (with cases of 2 v 1 or even 3 v 1 but again. there is balance). this prevents gang banging in the first few turns unlike RP where many europe players will simply ally (or ally and gang bang anyone else in europe) at which point they go on to gang bang in middle eats and asia. this can also be done anywhere else. WWII also has different countries you can be (who knew that D=). each country starts with different land mass (no duh) as well as different starting income. while in RP, the amount of money you have might differ depending on what you buy, in the end it is of the same: choose RA/Blitz as strat and then spam tanks. walling? who cares. in a normal WWII game, you cant use NC with UK. you cant. you certainly cant use RA. The strat that works for USA is going to be different from manstein. WWII teaches people in a normal game that you need to use a different strategy depending on what country you have. in RP, the strat always ends up the same. And at the end of the day, you cant binge WWII and become a r 10 in 3 months.... you certainly can in RP (and yes. to all those low ranks who feel this is rankism, than please, dual a r 9 or 10 and show them how rank doesnt matter. I have wasted my time 1 v 1 low ranks to prove to them rank matters [which is then their excuse for losing] and no, I did not bother on making it a dual because it would not be fair..... also I dont do duals as I wear my less elo as a badge of pride from my old days as a r3 ).

Escrito por clovis1122, 14.09.2014 at 21:09

No thunder, you are wrong. You are trying to relate training with RP players. There is no relation between those. However, for your single argument:

Escrito por Tundy, 14.09.2014 at 20:44

Low ranks are only good if they are trained by high ranks, therefore a non-trained low rank can't beat a high rank.

You are conditioning the premise. IF low rank doesnt get trained by highranks. This happen today, but this was not the chase in Afterwind.

What would happen IF theses high rank get trained? then you can concluide that your premise is invalid when a low rank get trained. Have you even hear of << The student beat the teacher>> ?

stop putting words in my mouth, i never mentioned RP in this issue.

High ranks getting trained or not is not relevant to my argument, i will have to ask you to stop posting if you can't provide me with a relevant answer.